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Messages - GratefulDad

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31
Eboka Journals / Re: I think iboga can ruin your life.
« on: January 22, 2013, 01:08:14 AM »
Other than what has been said, people need to realize iboga is a drug and it has effects/side effects that occur when you take it.  While it may present a new/different viewpoint on your life or outlook, it wears off, and eventually completely leaves your system.  When it is gone, unless you've made permanent changes in your lifestyle and/or choices, you will go right back to feeling the way you did before. 

Iboga can be a catalyst for change, but the effects definitely wear off, so it alone CANNOT ruin your life unless you die, or you make decisions/choices that ruin your life after taking it.  No drug gives permanent effects or people wouldn't need to keep taking them. 

If you have a mental illness, it could exacerbate the issue, but it still wears off, so you could go back to taking whatever it is you were, and you should feel the same..  Iboga doesn't have permanent effects, people's choices can, though..

32
Introductions / Re: Hello all! Im new. Planning to flood.
« on: January 18, 2013, 07:32:20 PM »
I don't believe you need to be more accurate than to the tenth of a gram with any iboga product, and with root bark, to the gram is even okay.  100 mgs of ibogaine or it's other alkaloids won't make much difference during a flood dose, either way, IME..

33
Introductions / Re: Good To Meet You
« on: January 18, 2013, 07:06:43 PM »
For suboxone, it's recommended you switch to a short acting opiate for a month or more to reduce the amount of post acute withdrawal syndrome/symptoms (PAWS) you'll experience.  Something like morphine, oxycodone, or poppy pods (mostly morphine and codeine) will help your body's endorphin system adjust to a shorter cycle, so that it's all out of your system before the iboga metabolites are..  This helps you experience fewer/lesser PAWS and helps you recover faster.  Lot's of good info on subs here, if you do a quick search, like KIAP suggested..  Welcome to Eboka! :)

34
Introductions / Re: Hey, new to iboga with a question
« on: January 18, 2013, 06:56:32 PM »
15 mg/kg minimum, is what I'd do...

35
Introductions / Re: Extracting it myself
« on: January 15, 2013, 04:47:13 PM »
Unless you're using HCl, a scale that measures to a tenth, or 0.1, should be fine. 100mgs of TA either way won't make much difference..  Should be able to pick one up for $15-20 easily.

36
Eboka Talk / Re: Questions about Iboga and subutex
« on: December 17, 2012, 10:51:26 AM »
First of all I would like to say hello to everybody here. I only found this website recently and decided to register to get more information and experience of people who've been there and worn the t-shirt. Am relatively new to Iboga so am not too familiar with this medicine, I still need to learn about doses, how to digest Iboga and what types of Iboga's there are.

I am from London in the UK, and my situation is that I've been been taking subutex for the last 6 and a half years. I figure Iboga may be a solution in helping me get off subutex. I've read around where people are claiming that it's hard to detox subutex using Iboga, so my plan is to taper the subutex as comfortably as possible and give it about a month free of subutex before I do the Iboga. My dose at the moment is 1mg and am thinking by April or May I would be at 0.1 or the lowest dose possible, and then be off.

I have a few questions if people can be kind enough to answer.

Would reducing my intake of subutex slowly give Iboga more chance of doing it's work? I figure that the more you mentally adjust and get use to feelings of less subbies in your system the more you can at least mentally succeed if you use Iboga. My problem is the mental concept of withdrawal and these PAWS I keep reading on about (from the subbies). I can just about handle the psychical withdrawal but issues such as fogginess, depression and sleep may be an issue, so am thinking Iboga can at least give me a leg up.

Reducing your intake will definitely make iboga's job much easier.  Ideally, most people recommend switching to a shorter acting opiate, such as morphine, or anything with a much shorter half life, for about a month or so before iboga, because that also will greatly reduce the amount of post acute withdrawal symptoms you'll feel, (PAWS)..

Secondly is it possible to use boosters instead of a flood to help with lingering withdrawal symptoms or post residual symptoms? if I can get past the acute withdrawal am figuring boosters may be all is needed? considering I am tapering off the subutex slowly as possible.
 

Booster doses will definitely help reduce withdrawal symptoms, but without doing the flood, you would have to dose pretty decent sized amounts to really knock out all the withdrawal, and over time the accumulation will likely start to make you a little loopy, or in psychedelic mode.  I think it's best to do the full flood, then just use small boosters for a couple weeks after, as needed, to knock out the PAWS.. This way works best, and allows you the benefit of storing iboga metabolites in your fat that are released over time, but don't necessarily make you trip, they just keep away cravings and withdrawal..  This gives you the "ibo-glow" some people speak of after their floods.

Thirdly what is the best Iboga to use for people on long term subutex use? I emailed Michelle from Ibogaworld and she suggest TA, especially as boosters for PAWS, can TA be used as a flood dose as well?

TA can be used to flood, fully, it's what I have always used to flood, but by most accounts, the TA lasts much longer and has a few added effects, from extra alkaloids, than the HCl does.  The HCl seems to have the shortest recovery time, but for the long acting opiates, and tougher cases, I think a good mix of HCl and TA is what would work best.  Michelle usually gives great dosing advice, IMO, and I would follow her guidelines, but would also grab some extra TA or bark just in case.  They are great for boosters, and if you are not fully immersed while flooding, that little extra push from some more TA can really help out with the visions.  Bark is by far the most difficult to fully flood on..

How often do people usually take boosters  and what type of boosters do they use, for instance in PAWS  how many grams would you use and how often? whether once a week or once a month, and what type of Iboga.

This will vary from person to person, and I suggest listening to your body, because what works for me, may not work as well for you and vice versa.  However, a good booster would probably be like 8-10 mg/kg, and that could be done at the 90 day period, but for right after the flood, maybe 200-500 mgs of TA once a week for a month after, or a few grams of bark one day each week.  That worked for me.  If you are getting PAWS, taking just enough to feel it, often will remove many of those symptoms, but too many days in a row, and you will definitely want to take a break.  So just kind of try the guidelines I suggested, but adjust it as needed to make you most comfortable..

and lastly is the amount of Iboga judged on your weight or can it also be judged on the length of your time on opiates, and in my case subutex 6 year usage. Am thinking I may need to use more Iboga then people on heroin and similar opiates, or is it strictly  only based on your weight?

Most doses are calculated by your weight, however, a good provider will take into consideration the length of the addiction, and type of opiate, (especially the long acing ones, aka LAOs), your responsiveness to other psychedelic experiences, or your experience with them, and more.  Some people will need more like 25-30 mgs/kg, while some may get away with 12-15 mg/kg.  Women tend to be slightly more sensitive..  But for people like me, I would do 30 mg/kg easily, because I am pretty insensitive to almost every drug, especially psychedelics..

Am looking for providers but they seem hard to come by in the UK, I contract Sara Glatt from Amsterdam in Holland but I believe she is going through a court case right now, hopefully by May or April she can be available or I can find someone closer to home. Or I may want to do Iboga in the near future so would prefer if I knew providers quickly as possible. I don't think I want to do it alone with a sitter or can this suffice?

Doing it with a sitter is possible, but you need to really do all your research, and make sure you have a sitter that is ready and willing to take on what can be a difficult experience, and who is prepared to do anything necessary, should something go wrong.  They will need to monitor you at least every few hours for 2 days without getting sleep, and may need to help you to the bathroom, clean up puke, and not panic when you are overwhelmed by the trip.  They need to recognize any signs of danger, and should be able to take your pulse, and blood pressure too, ideally.  Many have gotten by with less, but it's not a great idea to gamble with your life.  There are a few UK providers, but I don't know how reputable they are personally.

Sara treated me, my first time, and I would recommend her, had she not been dealing with the courts.  Perhaps she has someone she could recommend, or if you hang out here, you may run across some other opinions, or even providers that you would feel comfortable with.  Whatever you decide, we'll do our best to help you make the best decisions you can, armed with all the information we can help you gather..

I know the requirements such as pre-screening but am wondering can anybody here check my EKG and other tests to see if I can be a candidate? my doctor does not know much about Iboga so would not be able to tell if am a candidate for Iboga, also the fact I will have to make up an excuse to get tested because unless you're showing symptoms such as pain and have an alcohol problem they won't give you any tests.


Thank you for reading my case and I look forward from people's responses to enable me to make more of an informed decision in due course.


You can probably get an EKG if you complain of chest pains..  I can't read them personally, but I am pretty sure we have someone here who could read it, or knows someone who can, so stick around..  You just need to check out that you have no weird arrhythmia, or a prolonged QT wave, and I am not sure what else..  Anyways, hope you can find all the answers you need, and welcome to Eboka,  I am sure other members will also offer any advice they can.

:)

37
Eboka Talk / Re: Guidelines for Sitters
« on: December 17, 2012, 08:28:12 AM »
I took a test dose of iboga extract about 24 hours after my last methadone dose, and flooded that evening, so I still had methadone in my system when I flooded with 5 grams of TA, and I weighed 140 lbs at the time..  It worked very well, and I never went in to too much withdrawal..

38
Flooding / Re: Introducing yourself to Iboga before a flood
« on: December 17, 2012, 08:25:25 AM »
Two floods very close together has made a few people a bit loopy, from what i have read.  That Nobu character said he did two floods in one month, and was in ibogaland for six months, and couldn't think straight, for awhile..  I am interested in how you wound up in an ambulance, too..

39
Introductions / Re: iboga Slovenia
« on: December 17, 2012, 08:18:03 AM »
Got a link?

40
Eboka Talk / Re: can Iboga cure herpes?
« on: December 14, 2012, 04:30:46 PM »
KIAP, I want you to give me some Kambo sometime.  I don't want to do it myself. :)

41
Introductions / Re: iboga Slovenia
« on: December 14, 2012, 04:23:22 PM »
Sorry, no, but we'd love to hear if you find out anything!  Welcome to eboka, I hope we can help, perhaps one of our other members knows, or knows of them, we'll see.  Otherwise we have a lot of great info to use when looking for a decent facility..  Good luck to you!

42
Eboka Talk / Re: Advice needed: Flood or booster for a relapse?
« on: December 14, 2012, 04:17:19 PM »
KIAP has said everything I would. 

Personally, I would say screw 14mg/kg, and would shoot for 25-30..  With my first flood, I did about 5 grams of TA, at around 140 lbs, which means if the TA was 60% pure, or 3 grams of actual pure alkaloids, then my dose would have been 47-48 mg/kg of iboga alkaloids.  That is me though.

Knowing what I know about iboga and the experience, especially in using it to kick opiates, I would probably do something like 15-20 mg/kg of ibogaine HCl, and then like 10mg/kg TA, and expect to get an ass whoopin'.  Many think I am a little psycho, but if you want to know what I think works well, and the way I would do so in the future, here it is.. 

After you take your last short acting opiate dose, and it's about time to take your next dose, wait a little bit.  When you are starting to get minor symptoms (hot flashes or sweats, or that nervous goosebump-y feeling), take a small dose around 1-200 mg of ibogaine HCl.  I would time it so that I took the 1-200 mg when it was time to take my morning/early afternoon (11 am-1 pm) dose.  Then as the ibogaine starts to kicks in, the withdrawal should subside for several hours that day..

I would eat a light healthy breakfast , healthy snack or light lunch.  You want something you can digest and get into your intestines before you are going to do the iboga, basically.  But nothing in your stomach digesting when you are going to take the full flood.  For me this is important, because I am thin and going a couple days without eating makes me very thin and frail after the experience. 

When you start to feel some withdrawal starting up, probably in the early evening, then make sure you have your area set up, sitter ready, and all preparations made to make it as comfortable and safe as possible.  (quiet, dark, calm, etc.)  Then I would do some really pure/potent HCl/PTA mix.  For me, it would be around 25-30 mgs/kg and 60-80% of that HCl and 20-40% PTA..  I think, personally, that is the exact way I would go about treating myself for another addiction. 

I am not recommending you do this for yourself, because you know your body and mind better than I ever could, but you can get an idea of what kind of guidelines I would use for the kind of person I am.  If you don't know me very well (basically a crazy psychonaut that is extremely insensitive to almost everything), go to my profile and click on the list of all my posts, and take a brief look through the titles and skim a few of my earlier posts when I tried to give people an idea of my philosophies and personality.  :)

Anyways, good luck, and don't worry about relapsing, there are very few of us who can do it once and walk away forever.  However, thanks to iboga, we do have the ability to work at getting better, much easier, and that is the way most addicts have to live to eventually attain a life where they are comfortable and happy without needing to take a substance, or certain substances, or whatever your goal is with it..

43
General Discussion / Re: the funny thing about pods
« on: December 14, 2012, 03:25:35 PM »
Adding a pinch or two of coffee (not too much, since you have to steep it) to the powdered poppy stuff before brewing it makes it taste just like coffee (I preferred hazelnut), and you don't even taste or smell the pods at all.  I would often use decaf, too, because I don't like caffeine much..

44
Introductions / Re: new guy
« on: December 14, 2012, 03:19:17 PM »
I took 5 grams of TA at around 140 lbs, which at 60% pure alkaloids, would still be around 47-48 mgs/kg, so I wouldn't be afraid to take her advice, and also grab a little extra just in case, or for boosters as needed.  Under doing it on iboga can lead to discouragement/disappointment, and you really need to crack open your head that first time, to give your body/mind the very best chance at full on change.  Any unhealthy habits will drop away easier, regardless of the significance of the spiritual trip to you personally, due to the metabolites stored in your system after the flood, so even if you never get some profound revelation, the physical effects of a large dose will almost make it seem to feel better to do better, healthier things, subconsciously..

45
From Chris Jenks, via ibogaine.mindvox.com email list..

Quote
I wanted to make sure to put the latest refinements into a procedure to prevent, if possible, any loss of ibogaine:

  Powder the root or root bark and weigh one kilogram of it into two 20 Liter plastic buckets, each with 500 grams. To the first bucket add 2.5 Liters of water and 20 mL of concentrated HCl and stir occasionally for one hour. Filter this mixture through a new pillow case into the second bucket and add the same amounts of water and acid again to the first bucket. After another hour of occasional stirring of both buckets, filter the extract from the second bucket through the pillow case into a third bucket, filter the mixture in the first bucket into the second bucket, and add fresh water and acid to the first bucket. The extract in the third bucket is basified using 106 mL of 10% sodium hydroxide solution and filtered through large, pre-weighed coffee filter paper. The same sequence for the two buckets of root is repeated until water and acid have been added to the first bucket nine times. The extract from the first bucket is used to extract the contents of the second one last time, and then this extract is filtered, made basic and filtered like the previous eight. The coffee filter papers are rinsed with water and laid on dry towels in streams of warm air to dry. The dried TA is weighed, ground and optionally sifted and reground.

  If new pillow cases were used, no further processing of the TA should be necessary since the fabric will not have degraded from exposure to the HCl. Otherwise, to make "super TA" which lacks root pulp, the TA can be redissolved in acid, filtered and precipitated with base. To do this, place 50 grams of powdered TA and a stir bar into a 1 Liter Erlenmeyer flask and add 400 mL of water and 4 mL of concentrated HCl. Stir the flask for an hour and filter the mixture through paper. Return the solid from the filter to the flask and add the same amounts of water and acid a second and third time, stirring and filtering in between. Basify the combined filtrates with 63 mL of 10% sodium hydroxide solution and filter, rinse and dry the precipitated super TA through pre-weighed laboratory filter paper. This super TA should have nearly the potency of PTA HCl.

  To prepare PTA HCl, place 50 grams of TA into a funnel with a pre-weighed filter paper. Extract the TA with 750 mL of acetone, stirring occasionally. Put the covered flask of filtrate in the refrigerator and place the drained filter in a stream of warm air until all the smell of acetone is gone and the paper loses no further weight, and determine the weight lost by the TA due to extraction. Multiply this weight loss in grams by 3/7 to determine the number of milliliters of concentrated HCl to add to the filtrate. Add this with stirring over several minutes dropwise. If a fluffy material separates during this addition process (an oily, non-solid precipitate is suspected to be caused by the presence of root pulp in the TA or a poor quality of root material), stop the stirring after half of the planned acid has been added, let the fluff settle and decant the solution from the fluff. Rinse the fluff with 50 mL of fresh acetone and add this to the solution before proceeding with the acid addition. Once all the acid has been added, or the mixture has become acidic, let the flask sit in the refrigerator overnight before filtering and drying the PTA HCl on pre-weighed laboratory filter paper. Any solid which deposits on the sides of the flask can be most effectively removed by scraping it with a spoon into a small amount of fresh acetone and rinsed into the wet PTA HCl filter before drying.

  The acetone filtrate that the PTA HCl was removed from is placed in a 2
L round bottom flask with a stir bar and distilled until about 10% of the
original volume is left. The remaining mixture is poured into a glass
casserole dish and set outside in a stream of warm air until all the
acetone has evaporated, leaving a non-mobile brown oil. This dark, syrupy
residue is dissolved in 500 mL of water from both the distillation flask
and the casserole dish and filtered through laboratory filter paper. The
filtered solution is then made basic with 50 mL of 30% ammonia, mixed
thoroughly, and filtered through pre-weighed laboratory filter paper. The
light yellow solid dries into light chalky pieces which can be stored
indefinitely in the freezer. The acetone distillate is redistilled with
stirring from 5 grams of sodium hydroxide pellets to remove traces of
hydrochloric acid, giving wet acetone suitable for cleaning purposes.

  ** DISCLAIMER **

  NONE OF THE ABOVE PROCEDURE IS INTENDED FOR IMPLEMENTATION IN ANY COUNTRY WHERE ISOLATION OF IBOGAINE IS CONSIDERED TO BE A "CRIME".

Perhaps a pillow case with a very high thread count would be a better filter, and brand new, as well..

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