Author Topic: iboga microdosing contraindications  (Read 6459 times)

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Offline RhythmSpring

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iboga microdosing contraindications
« on: May 24, 2011, 09:20:47 PM »
This summer I plan to start microdosing with iboga (I did a flood back in february, the trip report is still being written (school's been busy)).

Yeah, so I plan on microdosing daily, but I like to do other drugs as well. I have on my a small variety of things I'd also like to do this summer, but I am unsure about how some of them would react to being on a low dose of iboga.

I have:
mushrooms (probably okay)
mdma (unsure)
salvia divinorum (oral) (probably okay?)
DXM (unsure)
Kratom (unsure)
Herbal ecstasy (unsure)
nitrous oxide (probably okay)

the ingredients of the herbal ecstasy are: crocus sativus, delosperma sp., cacao, paullinia cupana, citrus aurantium.

If any of you know of any dangers with doing these on a subthreshold dose of iboga, let me know. I plan on doing .3 - 1.6 g of rootbark per day, and I'm 120 lb.

Offline digital_phreedom

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2011, 11:52:26 PM »
Microdosing lowers your tolerance for things..

Probably lot's of things.. I'm not sure about all of them, but especially opiates..

Oh yeah.. and DO NOT take ecstasy with iboga in your system.. give that several weeks.  And likewise, do not take Iboga very close to having done MDMA.  Those will be very difficult experiences, and dangerous.

Not sure about the Kratom, but I would assume iboga will lower your tolerance for it, so start small.

Salvia should be just fine.

Oh yeah, DXM also, I would assume, is a big no-no, because of some of it's action being similar to opiates and some to mdma.. Seratonin syndrome is not fun.

Mushrooms I'm guessing are ok too.

Nitrous, probably fine.

Herbal ecstasy.. Are you sure those all ALL the ingredients?  Because those manufacturers don't always have to label all the ingredients.. Just like K-2 and 'spice' smokes, when they first came out.. You didn't see anything on those packages about them containing JWH's and all those other things.

That's a good question in general.. But remember, I'm NOT a doctor.. this is all just my opinion.

If you're planning on using any/all of those things while microdosing iboga, it will have effects on several of them I'm sure, so be very careful.
Embrace this moment, remember: We are eternal. All this pain is an illusion.

Offline rho

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2011, 12:58:27 AM »
I hope your microdosing has a similar effect on you as it did for me and basically eliminated my craving for anything. I didn't even drink coffee for like 2 months, and I felt amazing.

I would not mix iboga with anything stimulating (based on gut feeling), and the potentiation of opiates could cause more dramatic effects than expected.

The only things I mix with it is harmalas, ayahuasca, and mj.

good luck!

Offline RhythmSpring

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2011, 02:12:55 AM »
Thank you, guys! Okay, will avoid the mdma and dxm, and start small with the kratom (I probably won't want it anyway).

Actually, I might as well mention the perscription drugs i'll be taking as well... I have rheumatoid arthritis, and I'm taking immunosupressants to combat the inflammation. They are methotrexate and enbrel. One is a TNF-alpha interceptor (the enbrel) and the other inhibits the folic acid pathway in the body, inhibiting the growth of all cells that grow rapidly. Ugh, I hate methotrexate. I may end up stopping it while I'm on the iboga if it helps with my arthritis. It got rid of the inflammation when I flooded, so I am hoping microdosing will also help.

I wonder if the methotrexate / enbrel combination will interact with the iboga...

Offline rho

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2011, 12:52:40 PM »
Hrm, that's a good question for a professional provider or a doctor that is familiar with iboga pharmacology. If I were making the choices I would attempt to stop those meds and see if small rb doses alleviate the problems. What are the issues associated with stopping those medications temporarily?

Offline RhythmSpring

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2011, 03:07:04 PM »
^ Just worsening of symptoms: inflammation of the large joints, mainly.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2011, 03:08:19 AM by RhythmSpring »

Offline rho

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #6 on: May 26, 2011, 03:11:36 PM »
Ultimately it's up to you, but I think a valid approach would be to stop the arthritis meds (how long acting are they?) and then start dosing rb and see if your symptoms go away. Iboga made my achy joints calm down but my joint issues don't sound as severe as yours. I hope it works out for you whatever you decide to do.

Offline Calaquendi

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2011, 01:05:42 PM »
I personally can't 'sign off' on doing anything while you are using a micro-dosing (MD) protocol - first, why are you going to micro-dose? For how long? Whatever ends you wish to achieve using the MD  schedule I would think you'd be best served only using the iboga until your needs/desires are met. I mean, are you looking to manage some lingering PAWS? Is this just something you want to do to help you integrate the flood session you recently had? MD is a great tool to augment and solidify the things we learned during a flood, and it has merit on its own too - but I would avoid using any of the drugs you mentioned unless you have a very specific agenda with some of them...mushrooms for example, I have done them with a small dose of root bark and had great results - a very profound and spiritual experience.

Things like DXM I am personally not a fan of and would caution concomitant iboga use with anything (at all) that you deem questionable.

Again, I think intention plays an enormous role in any of our endeavors with chemicals, and asking 'why am I doing this' is a legit starting point. Are you simply curious about mixing iboga with some of these other things? Or do you plan to microdose intermittently throughout the season and want to know if it will interfere with any plans you might have to get down? Totally reasonable request there - but I can only advocate mixing iboga bark with another natural psychedelic, and then only in very small increments and with the utmost care  :)

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Offline RhythmSpring

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2011, 01:44:04 PM »
I personally can't 'sign off' on doing anything while you are using a micro-dosing (MD) protocol - first, why are you going to micro-dose? For how long? Whatever ends you wish to achieve using the MD  schedule I would think you'd be best served only using the iboga until your needs/desires are met. I mean, are you looking to manage some lingering PAWS? Is this just something you want to do to help you integrate the flood session you recently had? MD is a great tool to augment and solidify the things we learned during a flood, and it has merit on its own too - but I would avoid using any of the drugs you mentioned unless you have a very specific agenda with some of them...mushrooms for example, I have done them with a small dose of root bark and had great results - a very profound and spiritual experience.

Things like DXM I am personally not a fan of and would caution concomitant iboga use with anything (at all) that you deem questionable.

Again, I think intention plays an enormous role in any of our endeavors with chemicals, and asking 'why am I doing this' is a legit starting point. Are you simply curious about mixing iboga with some of these other things? Or do you plan to microdose intermittently throughout the season and want to know if it will interfere with any plans you might have to get down? Totally reasonable request there - but I can only advocate mixing iboga bark with another natural psychedelic, and then only in very small increments and with the utmost care  :)

These are all good questions, and thank you for asking them.

Back in February I flooded, and learned (un-learned) a lot, and it was a very valuable experience for me. However, right now I feel the lessons I learned slipping away.

I did Iboga for spiritual reasons, not because I was addicted to drugs. That said, I do have some significant problems I want to address with Iboga. If you find my first post on this forum, I mentioned some of my problems... just an overall unhealthy, overactive mind, addiction to food, internet, porn (i'm not sure if I mentioned that one, but I'm "off" right now), and negative thoughts.

In addition, I have some health issues: Rheumatoid Arthritis and POIS (Post Orgasm Illness Syndrome, a rare condition that leaves the orgasmer depressed, anxious and tense for weeks, even months after orgasm.). The flood temporarily relieved the arthritis, and it greatly (but not fully) abated the POIS symptoms henceforth.

Other psychedelics temporarily cure my arthritis as well, even on low doses, but I can't use them every day because of tolerance and the stress of being slightly altered all the time. Apparently Iboga must not have these problems if people are microdosing with it.

I'm also not the happiest person in the world (an understatement), and the vast majority of that unhappiness stems from my health problems. Today I am honestly just barely functional.

Offline RhythmSpring

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #9 on: May 29, 2011, 01:46:17 PM »
Oh, and I am rarely a recreational user of drugs. I use mushrooms, salvia, and other substances to learn from and expand my consciousness, improve myself as a person and learn how to be well.

Offline Calaquendi

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #10 on: May 29, 2011, 07:31:41 PM »
Hi Rhythm!

So I am getting you want to try microdosing for trying to stabilize your medical conditions?

It is my opinion that microdosing fits this very well for many people - it is even a suitable alternative to flooding if there are health concerns for the user.

Quote
Other psychedelics temporarily cure my arthritis as well, even on low doses, but I can't use them every day because of tolerance and the stress of being slightly altered all the time. Apparently Iboga must not have these problems if people are microdosing with it.

To use iboga for pain management is the holy grail for some people...there is another protocol which can be very dangerous if one is not thoroughly educated on the matter known as 'Dirty Maintenance' I know of a few people who have used this with great success, though as I said it can be real dangerous as it involves using iboga/ibogaine in conjunction with narcotic analgesics. This is a very slippery area and I do not recommend it - I have only talked with a few people personally off site and learned a great deal that way.
As for the particular meds you take for the arthritis, I am really unsure of the risks it may pose taking iboga together with it. There may be little or no enhanced risk, but I cannot say either way. Perhaps you could post elsewhere or if you have a doctor you can ask? I would be very interested to learn more about that.

I hear you on the stress of using psychedelics in that fashion, it isn't practical at all. This is what is meant by 'microdosing' - taking the root bark in very small sub-psychoactive amounts. Whatever an individuals personal threshold for sensation is, dose beneath that once a day for seven to ten days at a time.

This will usually manifest in sleeplessness and appetite loss after a few days, which is why people say discontinue after a week or so. Sometimes it is only tolerated for a few days at a time. You will know by listening to your body. Never push it with microdosing, it kinda goes against the very idea of doing it this way...

The whole aim is to achieve the health benefits without getting spun out of one's head. This can surely be done - just take it in very small amounts. I'm talking in milligrams of rootbark - some people get results with as little as 200mg of rootbark/day after a few days. Everyone is different.

It is a good idea to develop some kind of plan to suit your agenda and just start experimenting a little. Root bark is very forgiving to work with in this way, so long as we respect it  :)

I'd like to hear what you decide and I hope you can get some relief from the issues that are vexing you - I think you will be pleasantly surprised at the ways iboga can be used as a supplement. Good luck!
« Last Edit: May 29, 2011, 07:35:06 PM by Calaquendi »
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Offline RhythmSpring

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Re: iboga microdosing contraindications
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2011, 02:41:05 AM »
Quote
To use iboga for pain management is the holy grail for some people...
It's not pain reduction I'm going for, it's actual inflammation-stopping. It's amazing.

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'Dirty Maintenance'
I'm not interested in narcotics or "feel good" drugs. The closest I've come to those is Kratom, which I've done all of 4 times, and it's okay. I was hoping it would be more medicine than some kind of pleasure drug. Still not sure about where I stand with it. I'm not a user.

Quote
Perhaps you could post elsewhere or if you have a doctor you can ask?
I have also posted on the Advanced Drug Discussion section of the Bluelight.ru forum here: http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?t=573603 I've gotten some interesting responses. A few of them appear to be from one of the "dirty maintenance" people.

A doctor I can ask? Find me a doctor who has heard of Iboga/ibogaine. And then find me a doctor who knows how it interacts with methotrexate! hah! I do admit it's wholly unexplored territory, and therefore an unfair question on my part.

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I hear you on the stress of using psychedelics in that fashion, it isn't practical at all. This is what is meant by 'microdosing' - taking the root bark in very small sub-psychoactive amounts. Whatever an individuals personal threshold for sensation is, dose beneath that once a day for

I'm pretty in touch with how my body/mind is feeling at any given point. I doubt any significant dose will be sub-psychoactive to me. Kale is psychoactive to me.

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seven to ten days at a time.
Why only 7-10 days at a time? VaVar says you can do it continuously for months.

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This will usually manifest in sleeplessness and appetite loss after a few days, which is why people say discontinue after a week or so. Sometimes it is only tolerated for a few days at a time. You will know by listening to your body. Never push it with microdosing, it kinda goes against the very idea of doing it this way...

Well hm. I had the sleeplessness/appetite loss problem with microdosing with other things-- namely DOI. I stopped because of those things, but also it put my head in a weird place. It felt a little dirty. And I think tolerance was beginning to become an issue. But again, I might have been doing too much at a time. I started with 0.25mg every other day, and then I went down to 0.125mg, and i still felt it a little, but the benefits also decreased.
I hope Iboga won't give me that "dirty," stressed out feeling that DOI does.

I can deal with sleeplessness/appetite loss if that goes away after a while.

Thanks for the encouragement. I'm looking forward to using this powerful plant to my good health.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2011, 02:43:21 AM by RhythmSpring »