Author Topic: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits  (Read 15932 times)

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Offline strk.one

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #30 on: January 21, 2013, 10:06:35 PM »
Hey BT I get what you mean when you say tasting it thats what i was talking about . make it last and go with it. that break thru stuff is cool but you can ride it out to an end and glean something from the experience instead of scaring the shit out of your self if you "taste it".I havent flooded yet and then done this but it might be nice.  Anyways glad to hear you enjoyed it. I can stay there for up to 2 hours sometimes, its a beautiful place and the long experience i feel like i get some closer on what i encountered.The longer your in the more acclimated you get to that space and it gets more relaxing so you dont have to be in the fetal position the whole time.  :o  good times glad your still doing well....
Life is like a box of chocolates you never know whitch one is gonna have the rum in it...

Offline BlueTiger

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #31 on: January 21, 2013, 11:02:51 PM »
ta ta ta taste it.  mmmmm.  What a delight.  I can feel it is part of me already, like it doesn't feel foreign like psilocybin or lsd.  I am way beyond the fetal position.  I am not even capable of reaching the point of abusing entheogens.  But I would like to know what the eboka family's different ideas are on: Frequency of use and still being able to look yourself in the mirror....thanks in advance for sharing.  Hope my stories make you smile.  They certainly bring me joy and my intent is your delight.

Offline BlueTiger

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #32 on: January 24, 2013, 02:01:18 PM »
Still would like some feedback from people on DMT as to my questions asked earlier.  I found a great post by someone on a website talking about frequency of use and what's "acceptable."  He/she originally endorses daily DMT use, but something changes, and some insight is shared.  This person explains how they have realized that the beauty of the psychedelic world is all around us, even though we cannot always perceive it.  We do not need to be reminded of this everyday, just remember, and breathe it in.  They then change their recommendation to only once month use.  I can relate to this guys/gals thinking, and I want to reach that point of harmony in my life where I don't feel I need a psychedelic experience more than once a month. 

DMT has been divine post flood.  It's helped integrate the experience in many ways, making it easier to quit smoking cigarettes, shown me the beautiful psychedelic world that exists within our own (and beyond), and reminded me to stay on track so to speak.  I DO NOT advise people to mix DMT with Iboga.  I have been reminded twice now, that the two are not harmonious.  All of my best DMT moments have been on days I do not micro dose.  So, if you MD everyday and then start doing every other day, skipping two days, etc, the break in MDing is when tasting would be best IMHO.  Breaking through was amazing, but I have not felt the need to since then.  Just tasting a little when the moment strikes has been very therapeutic.  It makes me wish I was an artist. 

Offline Calaquendi

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #33 on: January 24, 2013, 02:42:43 PM »
I had what I can only refer to as a 'honeymoon' with DMT after my first breakthrough experience on it. I think I messed around for about four to six weeks before I got to the point of truly being ready for the full spectrum of effects. It seemed that my initial fears were replaced by curiosity and wonder about what it really was about, instead of the pretty colors and neeto body waves I was experiencing I instinctively knew that if I could just summon the yarbles to smoke past threshold that a whole new world would open up. And so it did. The closest I can come to explaining what it was like is that it felt like being born. Literally...born. I wept, it was the single most unbelievable, impossible and incredible experience of my life, a Love and gratitude for Being that I did not know existed - but was (and is) there all the while. I get goosebumps recalling it.

So, I had, after this initial breakthrough, a time period where it seemed like I could barely get enough of it - I was hungry for experience and it had soooo much power and so much to show me, that I smoked it at least weekly for probably a year. Then it got weird...I even wrote Dr, Rick Strassman to explain some of the strangeness I was experiencing and to my utter surprise he got back with me the same day...twice! Naturally he could not 'officially' endorse anyone taking a schedule one substance - but woven in his words was a caution that I should just lay off for a while , that I was too 'taken' with it and should basically chill...what a novel idea!

I am an addictive personality in every way - evidenced by my reaction to anything that makes me feel good or fascinates me, I can abuse things that are not even abusable. So I did lay off, and the strangeness laid off with it, I garnered some real respect for the stuff, instead of just being blown away by it and treating it like an amusement park ride, it bitch slapped me a few times - which I totally had coming - and after some freaky, scary weirdness and alien encounters, I had to re evaluate my relationship with the material and learn the hard way. But learn I did and I have a deep reverence for it and its powers of communication and its awesome abilities as an infinite entity of utterly incomprehensible vastness and beauty. It felt like a part of me, like I was coming Home after a long sojourn away....even to this day nothing can move me like DMT. Yet now I can and do go months on end without even thinking about using any, but every so often I will get an itch, and nothing else will suffice if I have it in mind to explore those realms.

Good thread I'll let others chime in  ;)

" I am you and what I see is me..."

Offline lalababa

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #34 on: January 25, 2013, 01:45:53 AM »
I Love DMT, though I haven't taken it in some time, even though I have some.  My last experience was the only scary one I had ever had, I saw the Alien Greys, but something happened that made it so worth while.  In the fetal position, I had saline or tears (though I wasn't crying) just pour into a puddle in the bed... I fell asleep, the next day I felt so amazing and had been feeling a bit crap before.  It felt I had purged some major toxins from my body.  I will be visiting DMT again soon, it has been at least six months.  I used it more often when I was still on opiates, it made me want to quit, gave me some beautiful experiences and some of pure guilt for my addiction.  After Iboga, I smoked less, it seemed that Iboga was still there and being a bit confrontational to the other spirit... I clearly heard Iboga tell me to clean my room and stop smoking in his stern voice! Ha... Loved that I guess... this is making me want to experience it again and soon.

Offline BlueTiger

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #35 on: January 25, 2013, 01:23:59 PM »
So as I previously posted regarding the benefits of DMT for me currently, I am also wondering about the potential downsides considering I am not trying to be an astronaut indefinitely, but instead, regain homeostasis. 

I was very depressed yesterday and today.  The feeling was so profound that it was all encompassing, crippling (same feeling I had when I was abusing opiates)....it was my 4 year anniversary too, which only made me go deeper into my hole since we could not even go out to dinner, let alone be kind to each other.  The external factors are not as important for this thread.  The question I am pondering is this:  If Noribogaine acts as an SSRI, and DMT also increases serotonin in the brain, then couldn't this lead to a potentially harmful state?  Maybe not serotonin syndrome, but are there toxic levels that are not categorized as Serotonin Syndrome?  Most importantly, are there signs that I should be looking for that indicate seek medical attention? 

DMT is on the back burner, as is MDing for the moment being.  I know people say quitting cigs and opiates at once can be bad, but my brain won't let me pick up another fucking cigarette again.  Done after a decade of slavery!  I have reached a point where I have flooded 4 times last year, and have not worked in 9 months.  There is no more room for backslides anymore.  Iboga resides at the core of my being after my last flood and beats the cautionary and powerfully vibrating drum that prevents me from ever slipping backwards. 

Cal, maybe you can elaborate on "the weirdness" you felt.  I feel all types of weird today.  If it wasn't for all the hard work I have been doing, my Mantra yoga today, and the prospect of meeting a well connected neighbor for lunch, I may have gone off the deep end.  Scary feeling guys.  Still no relapse, no cigarettes, no alcohol, smoking weed, breaking from DMT, eating fairly healthy, took a 5HTP today in an attempt to hopefully aid in any severe fluctuations in Serotonin levels. 

I am trying to man up and make it to this "business" meeting, leaving in less than an hour.  There is a weird cycling going on that is not right, and I can identify it at points when I am not so low that I can escape the irrationality and step outside myself and try and self diagnose. 

Seriously, if it was not for all the hard work that has been put into ridding myself of all these toxins and incorporating all that is good as often as possible (especially since last Christmas), I would be scared about a major slip.....31 days post flood. 

Ebokians all over, your feedback is appreciated.  Thank you.  Peace, B

P.S. I am very aware of all the crazy changes that are happening inside me with my change in lifestyle, and entheogenic super healing.  It is exhilarating, exhausting, confusing, amazing, unsettling, but I wouldn't have it any other way.  Done MDing despite that fact that I don't fully want to.  Done DMTing because I have no idea what is going on upstairs.  Going to spend the weekend regaining my composure, cause it went out the window last night. 
« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 01:44:02 PM by BlueTiger »

Offline DiamondHeart

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #36 on: January 25, 2013, 02:22:06 PM »
Well just to add another data point to this discussion. I have just started microdosing Aya - taking just a little each day. When I've taken a full dose, I just purge - no visuals but can certainly feel than I am "under the influence" , at the edge of getting through the veil.

So, taking small doses has been interesting for me - paying attention to the very subtle effect it has on my body and brain. A bit like strictly platonic dating instead of "going the whole way"...!

Offline lalababa

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #37 on: January 25, 2013, 02:38:50 PM »
Blue Tiger, as you  know I don't have a lot of time today, I am sorry for that.  I do want to see what others think about you laying off of the MD'ing for awhile.  After my initial flood, I took two large boosters or "mini floods" as I have heard some call them... I started to get pretty depressed, especially after a friend died.  I was told that I had taken too much and I needed to take a break, and I listened, I didn't do anymore for quite some time, not even a small amount of RB... I did start to regain my strength and started feeling pretty Amazing even after a couple of weeks.  Ibo can be taxing on the body and mind after a flood and possibly microdosing too much could just extend that worn out feeling, mentally and physically.  You already have built up your "ocean" of Nori... I believe that if you quit for awhile you will start to feel much better... there may be a few rough days but just push through them, you should be feeling wonderful in no time.  I'd like to hear from someone with more experience with microdosing, as I don't have a whole lot of it... though after the sadness of yet another death of someone close I may start MD'ing myself here soon... Another funeral today, then my little nephews birthday Sunday.. cycle of life on a weekend for me... I know that we have talked about this already but I would like to hear from someone else with more experience on how long after a flood it is okay to microdose, or if possibly Ibo itself is just telling you to take a break.
Much Love
lala

Offline BlueTiger

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #38 on: January 25, 2013, 06:51:45 PM »
I have just started microdosing Aya - taking just a little each day. When I've taken a full dose, I just purge - no visuals but can certainly feel than I am "under the influence" , at the edge of getting through the veil.  So, taking small doses has been interesting for me - paying attention to the very subtle effect it has on my body and brain. A bit like strictly platonic dating instead of "going the whole way"...!
Very interesting.  Thanks for sharing entheo.  You make it sound similar to Iboga MDing.   My goal for 2013 is no opiates and no cigarettes, and that's just in terms of what I am giving up.  I am also adding yoga, more interesting employment, maybe school, more nature, eboka.......
As a note, I was told by a wise man that 3 weeks of MDing is typical post flood, and to not go beyond that.  To skip, reduce, smile and breathe is what he told me, and I try to apply this to more than just MDing.  However, I want to explore if there is any merit to MDing aya, Iboga, etc throughout the year.  Seasonal MDing let's call it.  I know people do it, and maybe eboka needs a more organized log of this, or I just haven't found it yet.  I did my 3 weeks of MDing (plus a couple extra days), and the post DMT trials feeling of deep depression or low was what signified too much of something (maybe serotonin?).  The intense cycle of feeling divine, okay, to deepest low had not happened since I started the DMT trials this week. 

Thanks Lala for reminding me the importance of stopping.  I feel better already.  Slowly, but surely.  ;)  The ocean is there and I can feel myself stabilizing within it, and I smile  :)  and breathe 8)  Lala, please let me know if there is anything I can do to make this weekend/next week easier on you.  Don't hesitate. 

I am of course now interested in aya MDing.  Maybe next season. 
I am wondering if there are any threads or protocols people could share regarding seasonal MDing? 
How many 3 week rounds let's say would be advised in a year span without reaching toxicity? 
If 3 weeks is the best route with Iboga MDing (skip, reduce, etc), then what would that be for aya? 
Is it good to mix up the Iboga and aya seasonal MDing due to toxicity?
(i.e. Winter 3 weeks Iboga, Spring 3 weeks aya, etc) 

I would like to hear from someone else with more experience on how long after a flood it is okay to microdose, or if possibly Ibo itself is just telling you to take a break.

A 3 week span is what was recommended to me, and I started on Day 7 post flood, but heard day 4 is okay as well to begin. The treatment center I went to gave me MD's on day 1 or 2.....
My awareness of myself was off in the last few days.  I needed a DMT reminder that I needed to stop.  This is why tuning in is sooo important.  The incredible level of biofeedback one can pick up on post flood is an "angelic gift" as another put it.  Not something to be wasted.

I wept, it was the single most unbelievable, impossible and incredible experience of my life, a Love and gratitude for Being that I did not know existed - but was (and is) there all the while. I get goosebumps recalling it.
Then it got weird...I even wrote Dr, Rick Strassman to explain some of the strangeness I was experiencing and to my utter surprise he got back with me the same day...twice!
.....treating it like an amusement park ride, it bitch slapped me a few times - which I totally had coming - and after some freaky, scary weirdness and alien encounters, I had to re evaluate my relationship with the material and learn the hard way. But learn I did and I have a deep reverence for it and its powers of communication and its awesome abilities as an infinite entity of utterly incomprehensible vastness and beauty. It felt like a part of me, like I was coming Home after a long sojourn away
Cal, thank you for sharing this.  I know you are busy and i hope you are well.  If you have a moment, please elaborate on some of this.  That is very cool you communicated with Strassman and he responded, maybe a similar reassurance I received after speaking with Mash.  I will learn from your story and not treat DMT like an amusement park ride.  "Bitch slapped" by DMT use conjures up some scary images in my head.  I am tapping into the deep reverence you speak of.  Guidance through yours and others stories also aids me in reaching the Mecca of respect. 

One Love,  B

P.S.  During my DMT trials this week which led to stopping DMT and Mding, one cool thing worth sharing, I did taste some DMT after an acupuncture session, which led to beams of light shooting out of my body in a number of directions.  No breaking through, but kind of wild.  I also took a rip after a massage session, and I had been out of it from the massage and not smiling, but was fairly relaxed.  I took the rip and my face almost uncontrollably went into this great smile.  My interpretation was to remember the power of a smile.   

« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 07:28:44 PM by BlueTiger »

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #39 on: January 25, 2013, 07:10:50 PM »
Quote
If Noribogaine acts as an SSRI, and DMT also increases serotonin in the brain, then couldn't this lead to a potentially harmful state?  Maybe not serotonin syndrome, but are there toxic levels that are not categorized as Serotonin Syndrome? 

I certainly concur.  Need to be very careful on this.  People @one time were saying to add a bit of Ibo in the Aya, I made the mistake of trying this one evening and it almost caused what I believe to be Serotonin Syndrome.  Ever since that time I have strongly dissuaded folks from combining Iboga/Noribogaine and DMT.  I honestly am not sure what was going on with the guy (he was an old timeron Eboka and went to Gabon and then stopped posting here) that said he had success combining the two.  I do combine Tabernaemontana Sananho and Tabernaemontana Undulata in my brews but they seem to act totally different in their makeup than does Tabernanthe even though they are "cousins".  I know you were specifically talking about Noribogaine and DMT but I found it relevant with my past experiences. 

I hate to give advice but IMO what Lala said is spot on, no matter what your treatment provider said/says. 

Offline BlueTiger

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #40 on: January 25, 2013, 07:29:06 PM »
Quote
People @one time were saying to add a bit of Ibo in the Aya, I made the mistake of trying this one evening and it almost caused what I believe to be Serotonin Syndrome.  Ever since that time I have strongly dissuaded folks from combining Iboga/Noribogaine and DMT.....I do combine Tabernaemontana Sananho and Tabernaemontana Undulata in my brews but they seem to act totally different in their makeup than does Tabernanthe even though they are "cousins".

KP, thanks for your reply.  You just cleared up something for me here.....Ibo/Aya, Ibo/Changa, Ibo/DMT......serotonin is tricky and needs to be respected.  Your brews sounds wicked and I can't wait to one day go further.  In due time.  Set and setting. 

Offline strk.one

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #41 on: January 29, 2013, 10:26:14 AM »
Howdy just my 2 cents but i believe that even tho the d is related structurally to seratonin the d  is metabolized rapidly and im taking a leap of faith here but probly is not an ssri per se. the diff between the aya and the changa is they both contain the beta-carbolines and are most deff gonna effect the nori build up .. however it is cited that d has non selective affinity for many of the 5-ht receptors in the brain and agonistic actions on other 5-ht receptors and that a build up  ocurance has been detected. there is also non selective  affinity to adrenergic and dopamine receptors as well. With this said i would say that too much of a good thing is probly too much esp in-conjunction w other powerful tryptamine indole compounds such as nor-ibogaine. d is a special wonderful thing and as cal stated needs respect. an afterglow is deff detected even without the beta-carbolines added. Im almost positive that d not combined w the nori is less side effect producing. A combination of the 2 most likely has negative rebound effects due to the build up of both indoles. In a quest to make ones self better we grab at what ever is gonna make us better and i feel that although having tools is a must too many tools in the tool belt is gonna pull your pants down. alternate between what is synergistic and do the other things when the nori is lower, or less frequent venturing into the hyperspace, regarless of tasting. d is safe but combinations of seemingly innocuous things such as simple grapefruite juice can lead  to over or under dosing of chems/drugs in certain people depending on metabolism age etc... the d is gonna be a life long friend that can be used frequently the eboka is imho a special thing used infrequently and probably needs very little help or company with exceptions ie: fungus. With all this said I have yet to go flooding but have been thru the hyperspace. I guess everything has its time and place you have a life time to explore. Too many things at once can get muddy. Thanks for letting me share......
Life is like a box of chocolates you never know whitch one is gonna have the rum in it...

Offline BlueTiger

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #42 on: February 15, 2013, 09:04:58 PM »
DMT continues to amaze me....and is okay now that I am well past the 3 week mark of MDing RB.  Iboga is the center of my psychedelic evolution, so I feel compelled to write about this here. 

This DMT is very white and more powdery than crystals.  I know people like the other alks, and I would love to hear more about why?  What does it add to the experience?

I was determined to break through today.  I found that a ratio of 50:50 plant to powder was good. 
I am staring at the bowl (starting to hallucinate), while on hit #3, and suddenly my determination sparked out of the bowl like a synaptic explosion.  It was as if the burning ember sparked and burst into a magnesium lightning bolt that became the focal point of my worm hole travel. 

By the end of the experience, I was in tears of amazement, laughing from the wonder of it all.  That was 7 minutes later. 
The power is so raw! 
The bolt of lighting:  What was that?  Anyone else seen this burst of magnesium lightning?
I wonder what the brain looks like under imaging equipment at the moment something like that happens.
It finally opened up my mind to exploring the allure of an aya brew.  Brrrewwwahahahahahah! 


Offline lalababa

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #43 on: February 16, 2013, 03:28:44 PM »
Hey Blue Tiger!  Have you seen DMT: The Spirit Molecule ?  if not, I think you would enjoy it and get some good info.  It used to be on Netflix instant stream, not sure if it still is.  If not, I am sure I can dig up a copy and send it to you ;)

Offline Calaquendi

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Re: DMT and Iboga -- Frequencies feel like plant spirits
« Reply #44 on: February 22, 2013, 03:16:30 AM »
Just wanna point out strk.one is dead on with his info, good research.  ;)

Still, DMT has more speculation than science in human study - though I am inclined to believe certain elements - like pineal production (still theory)...I spent hours recently looking for very specific data about bio-mechanics of tryptamines, especially NN,DMT - it is so structurally similar to serotonin (5HT) yet its endogenous function remains pretty mysterious: and there is still conjecture regarding the 'specific relationship' between DMT and serotonin. It appears to be an agonist (or partial agonist) at specific cites which have serotonin affinities, some say this means that it either 'binds to' or 'competes with' 5HT at the receptor cite. I'm guessing this means it does not 'produce' serotonin or behave as an SSRI would to modulate its reabsorbtion. This means, in English, that DMT in any reasonable or even epic quantities is super unlikely to cause any harmful effects physically. I have read some stupid shit about ascertaining LD50
figures for DMT - not only have I found conflicting dosages, there is no real method to translate the animal data to humans, even IF it is accurate. I am an extreme fellow in some ways. Reckless even - I always said "DMT IS SAFER THAN DEIT COKE"- and I stand by that. I decided to see how far I could take this material once I felt I 'Had it'...I ate 300mg in capsules on ayahuasca. This will never ever happen again. I mention it because if some of the 'research' I have read of late had any substance, I'd have been pushing the limits of physical safety so close that its a marvel I can tie my own shoes, or even survived it. To be fair - at the time I was pretty sure I'd killed myself...BUT - that was a standard terror-reaction to one of my occasional episodes, not some brush with death for real.

Serotonin syndrome is very serious - and I think, very over hyped regarding the frequency which it truly occurs. If it was as easy to get as people say, 2/3 of everyone I know would be dead and raves would be graveyards. You have a much better chance of getting herpes. I do not discount safety at all but the serotonin syndrome has become a catch phrase for anti-drug propaganda and yes, you can take too much of ANYTHING and it will kill you. Even water intoxication is lethal. You'd never be able to smoke enough DMT to cause physical harm because you'd just fall out well before anything close to real danger approached. Here's an excerpt from a really good article -

'Since DMT binds to the same receptor sites as serotonin but does not produce a relaxing effect, it would be logical to assume that DMT is a 5-HT antagonist, meaning it blocks serotonin and depolarizes neurons, making them more excitable. This is not the case. There are many different types of 5-HT receptors, some inhibit neural activity and some promote neural activity. Like most hallucinogens, DMT is classified as a selective 5-HT2A partial or full agonist; also active at other 5-HT subtypes, at adrenal receptors, at Sigma-1 receptors, and at tertiary amine receptors. This means that DMT is active at many 5-HT sites and can mimic some of the agonistic functions of serotonin with varying frequency and efficacy.'
  -  http://psychedelic-information-theory.com/Psychedelic-Pharmacology

I think I can buy much of Strassman's hypotheses - I have long felt the relationship between DMT and sleep, many times had REMs on high doses and darkness is essential for optimal effects, leading one to apprehend possible and plausible correlations with structurally similar molecules (produced in pineal) like melatonin.. I will not smoke it during the day...all these notions and part-facts paint a clear picture in my own mind of DMT's safety and toxicity in humans. Plus, I have smoked my weight in it and so have plenty others.

Regarding 'mixing' powerful tryptamines, unless one is REAL uneducated or careless or plain suicidal, the likelihood of any significant problems is absolutely slight. Still, very good questions for any beginner with this material, because let's face it: feeling like you are going to die is damned scary, and if you do it right, you will certainly experience this eventually.

I have had uncomfortable experiences with DMT immediately following flood. Like twelve hours later I decided to experiment and it was just nasty...the DMT felt 'scratchy' and the whole episode was at odds with itself...yet I am right now only a few days out from a flood and if it had not been for a DMT session properly timed - close, but not as close as I tried before - this may have not been near as rich an experience. In fact it wouldn't have been. This is why some providers use mushroom tea as an adjunct to iboga therapy - and they do so right after the flood -within the first day or couple of days...psilocybin is a cousin of DMT so this makes sense. So much to learn, soooo much. I belong to the medicine crowd. If a 'supplemental' tryptamine is incorporated around the other side of a flood - I think it can do wonders, and it is safe to do so. So long as other medications are not on board I think it can be a boon.

Noribogaine seems to be somewhat of an SSRI - much more than ibogaine - and it stays with us for a long time usually...IME and IMO any effects experienced from other tryptamine use while under an 'ibo glow' are by and large very pleasant - even more so than usual - and also safe, provided people don't go nuts. In fact, the best mushroom experience I ever had was a few days after a TA boost.

This is an interesting and important topic - I have enjoyed the conversation. I must however leave because I can't see the screen and am still fuzzy, can't believe I got this far.

I will elaborate on the DMT weirdness, Tiger - but I can't tonight. I'm bust with cross eyed insomnia and I'm starting to forget what I'm doing. I leave you guys with a good score I found about comparing ibogaine and noribogaine - comparing parent molecule to metabolite. I will try to remember to put in in the Science forum too. I will be intermittently present while I continue my personal process, but should return in full force soon.

I'm probably forgetting something...

Yep, here's the pdf - http://earthworksbotanicals.com/journals/journal10.pdf
« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 04:17:05 AM by Calaquendi »
" I am you and what I see is me..."