Author Topic: Finally flooded, more questions then answers  (Read 3752 times)

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Offline Paradoxical

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Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« on: December 07, 2014, 12:59:14 PM »
Hello everyone. So I flooded at a treatment center in Mexico Thursday night. 27 male, 160 lbs, dosed with HcL at 19mg/kilo. The trip was honestly more of an unanswering mind fuck then anything else. I'm hoping that within a couple days I can sleep again, and I clear up and get this glow.

My thoughts seem to be even more scrambled then usual since my experience so please bear with me. I dosed around 6pm Thursday night. Medical facility, hooked up to an IV, EKG, etc. Dose was broken into a test dose then 4 main doses which were spaced 20 minutes apart. This last relapse lasted around 3 months. On Thanksgiving I overdosed on heroin, was marchman acted and involuntarily placed in detox. Which I got out of Monday morning and flew here. There were plans and a flight purchased for treatment before my overdose.

I arrived in Mexico and they put me on 2mg xanax a night and 80-120mg oxycodone a day for the first 2 days. Which I'm not gonna say no to. I'm a drug addict. Took my last 40mg oxy and xanax dose ~7pm Wednesday night. And started eating ibogaine around 24 hours later. After my 3rd dose it started coming on heavy. The feeling on energy coursing up and down my spine. Listening to some music. And here's what I can remember.

Let me say that problems with confidence, social skills, depression, mental/physical bad habits in general, were just as big of a deciding factor in deciding to flood as my opiate addiction. So I started to get some very minimal visuals after awhile. And my thoughts started turning into these layers of epiphanies. Which were very vague instead of clear. Some of which made sense, a lot which were completely nonsensical. I remember thinking about how duality kept being represented. After awhile of this I started getting closed eye visuals kind of a mixture between high dose psilocybin and DMT. It was beautiful. This was the best part of the experience. I think this lasted 4 hrs or so. I remember feeling like I needed to go deeper. That I robbed myself of the full experience because of setting and dose. Also that this is more or less what I expected from a treatment that was under 3 grand in Mexico. I at one point felt some entity try and pull me out of my 3rd eye but to no avail. Towards the end of my visionary experience I really wanted the IV out and the EKG off. Once it was off it was around 2-3am, and this is where the trip turned unpleasant.

All the thoughts going on were so incoherent. I'll try my best to piece them together. There were a lot of just completely random thoughts in my head. Nonsensical. I started to get this feeling of anxiety and fear. Spent a lot of time incoherently thinking about illuminati type things. I remember for an hr or so thinking how North Korea and Hungary were going to take over the world. Paranoia type feelings. Minimal close eye visuals, but they were still there. Still this feeling of all these ahha epiphanies right there that were hard to hold onto to. Around 8am or so I felt well enough to get up and smoke a cigarette and drink a smoothie. I felt so drained exhausted and depressed.

The following day just embodied the term grey day. I felt so heavy and grey and melancholy. It was introspective, but still not in a very productive way. This is an issue I deal with as well, it seems most people have thoughts, ideas, etc, constantly swirling around there head. My head just seems blank a lot of the time. Heavy on feelings, but hard to articulate. A lot of this day was spent just laying there, staring at the wall, feeling like shit. My mind felt scrambled.

I slept 4 hrs or so that night. Weird sexually oriented dreams. Like really weird. The next day I felt a million times better, but restless as hell. Which was different then, but definitely reminded me of withdrawal. Which made me think of how opiates would make it go away. So basically cravings. Here it is 9am the following day. Slept maybe 2-3 hrs last night. Feel worse today then yesterday.

It was a very intense experience all in all. I am glad I did it. I think it was a good meeting with a plant medicine that I may need to do a lot of work with. I'm already thinking of my next flood, which I want to be higher dose and full range of alkaloids. Also thinking and researching a lot about microdosing. I was hoping I'd have a better idea of what to do at this point in my life. And that I'd feel more positive after this experience. It definitely felt incomplete.

Also I don't feel any real intuition telling me to eat/think/make better decisions. I'm wondering where I should go as far as life and how to further work with this plant medicine.

Thanks a lot for taking the time to read this. Feels good to get it out of my head and onto the paper. Instead of asking a bunch of questions I'm gonna leave it open. Please let me know your thoughts, what you think I should do. If this experience is typical or atypical. Etc etc. Thank you!

Offline mo

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2014, 09:46:25 AM »
hi Paradoxical,

i took my time though i saw your post when you first posted it, i did not want to weigh in with my experience since i was never an addict and i sometimes feel that since i don't share the burden i should at least be careful ..

having said that, there is some general info that i could share.

for one, how do you feel by now? surely things have changed. one thing i hope is that you are staying away from drugs in general and alcohol in particular. i had one beer on the second day after a flood destroy the delicate balance that the medicine had established in my mind. just flushed it away. but if you have kept away from alcohol i encourage you to continue.

generally the medicine is very powerful and deeply rooted in your body and will work long term on a physical level. eat simple if you can - i know diet is so hard to keep. try your best. if you can't help overeating i suggest you go for unsalted/unseasoned/unoiled lentils and rice if you can bare it. it is so plain and simple and maybe it will do you good. that was pretty much my diet during a plant dieta in peru and this simple diet worked wonders over the course of 3 months. (there was also cooked fish, green platanas and on occasions eggs/potatoes, and boiled oats every morning - all unseasoned) - i know this is a far of advice and hard to keep, but maybe it is of some use .. i thought of mentioning it..

i wish you all the best - let us know how you are doing, alright?
bless you!
« Last Edit: December 09, 2014, 09:49:53 AM by mo »
in a universe like ours, to beings like us, the idea of a god dying can be quite liberating

Offline Paradoxical

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #2 on: December 10, 2014, 01:27:34 PM »
Thanks for the reply. I feel pretty good, mentally. More positive then normal. But I still do feel "dope sick" in a lot of ways. In particular that painful deep bone chill, anxiety, restless, and the no sleep has really sucked. I drank the day I got out of the treatment center to calm my nerves for the flight home. Alcohols never been a real problem though. I drank yesterday too, and actually did a little coke. Which Im a little let down about, but not all that much. I domt thimk I should do that again though. And I've been smoking herb. But I didn't go into this wanting to be completely sober. Opiates are what completely ruin me. I need to never touch them again, and don't think I will. Although I have been taking small doses of kratom because of how much residual withdraw I've had. Which I worry about since they tickle some opiod receptors.

I want to work more with then plant medicine. I know I have lots of work to do. I plan on going to Peru to drink ayahuasca and goto Costa Rica to take ibogaine  at Iboga House. How long should I wait to take another flood dose? And I plan on micro dosing until then.

Offline mo

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2014, 01:35:40 AM »
alright then. i'm glad you feel good. i wish for you that one day you will be happy sober - just  like that! reminds me of that Buddhist (i believe) blessing - may you be happy and free of suffering! :)

i hope some of the more experienced members will weigh in eventually also .. personally i always waited a year before flooding again. search the forum, you should be able enough info on that - to be sure .. i do remember though that iboga stays in your blood for a long time .. eg http://eboka.info/general-discussion/a-long-to-wait-between-floods/msg14689/#msg14689 but please look to more info than just two answers ..

good luck!
in a universe like ours, to beings like us, the idea of a god dying can be quite liberating

Offline lalababa

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2014, 07:58:23 PM »
Drank and did a little coke?  really?  Alcohol will flush all of that precious noribogaine out of your system faster than anything will.. well nothing else will except alcohol.  Mo warned you of that in his first post.

Well, I guess there isn't much else to say. 

good luck,
lalababa

Offline mudhen

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2014, 04:51:22 PM »
Hi Paradoxical,

I feel a bit grumpy about the treatment centers that don't address energetic practices and energetic states, but it does sound like you were carefully monitored medically.

19mg/kg is a good addiction interruption dose, but some people do need more. It sounds like you were wanting to go deeper. Perhaps the dose could have been adjusted up for you, perhaps not. Were you able to tell the treatment staff you wanted more?

Something I have recommended to everyone I have worked with with addiction interruption and iboga, is to take a booster dose within 30 days of their session. This can be a booster in the range of 3-7mg/kg, depending on the person and what they are experiencing afterward. I am hoping the clinic told you about this, and provided you with what you need, or that you have what you need to take this booster. It will help with residual withdrawals.

It is recommended to not use any substances for about (at least) 30 days after a session, to allow the experience to really 'take hold' and begin to intergate on many levels. Tho marijuana does not seem to impede the process. What would happen if you felt away you didn't want to feel, but did not take a substance to change it?

Your experience I suppose was neither typical nor atypical. Every person goes through something different, though I recognize common themes and elements in your process. The experience will continue to unfold for you, likely over the next year. Giving attention to the insights you gained, and spending time in reflection about your responsibility and choices, will help deepen the post processing. Spending time in Nature will also certainly help. If you are not inclined to meditate while in the woods, just being around trees while taking a walk can provide benefits.

This is only the beginning, as you have surmised. I appreciate your honesty and willingness to share and be open to feedback.





Offline Tyler

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #6 on: December 13, 2014, 11:30:56 AM »
I am living bit by bit, day by day ... and I can say ... questions are good. In my opinion, it is better to have more questions than answers. Because answers are the final step, but questions are just the beginning of making something ... life, or something like that? Do you understand my meaning?

Offline Paradoxical

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #7 on: December 13, 2014, 05:03:13 PM »
Thanks for all the feedback. It's very much appreciated.

Ya. I realize now the coke and alcohol was a terrible idea. At the center I was basically told that I could drink. And I took some LSD a few nights ago also. And it was quite an experience. Im not really comfortable talking about it yet, unless anyone wants to message me. But it took away a lot of those questions and showed me the one question I need to keep asking. It feels like it helped with a lot of energetic blockages. I'm quite aware Im still far from where I need and want to be though. And I'm going to do everything in my power to keep that momentum going.

Thanks again.
« Last Edit: December 13, 2014, 05:08:02 PM by Paradoxical »

Offline lalababa

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #8 on: December 14, 2014, 04:46:32 AM »
I am glad that you realize what a bad idea that was esp the alcohol, as I already said, it will just flush it all out and you basically waste the energy and expense that went into the flood.  There are some substances that do mix well with ibogaine... like mushrooms.  Some people do like a little LSD afterward ( not too soon) but some do not.  I was stupid and uninformed and smoked DMT during a flood.  I do not recommend it.  I smoked it a month later and still felt Iboga and DMT arguing within me.  Some substances can be even deadly to use near Iboga. like MDMA, I am sure anything that really messes with serotonin levels could be dangerous... so you really must be careful!  I wouldn't ever take anything afterward unless it has been suggested to you by several people who do have experience with the medicine!

Please be careful and I am glad you are still gaining insights :)

lalababa

Offline RhythmSpring

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #9 on: December 14, 2014, 10:47:36 AM »
I was thinking mushrooms would do you good. LSD's not far. I'm glad you clarified some of your energy. Curious about that one question.

An Ibogaine center that condones drinking, especially after a flood, is not one I would recommend people go to. What was the center?
« Last Edit: December 14, 2014, 10:49:55 AM by RhythmSpring »

Offline Paradoxical

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #10 on: December 14, 2014, 12:25:41 PM »
I'd rather not say the name of the center, because they didn't condone it. That was just me making exscuses. There was one person working there who was clean for 11 months who had drank pretty heavy he said his first month after the treatment. And he seemed to be doing good after 11 months. So I made that into its ok to drink. the place i went was 'incomplete' is the best description. But they were wonderful people who I know just want to help and are trying to find their way to do that.

I can imagine that the two opposing energies would be overpowering lala. One of my insights has been that I need ayahuasca to help clearing some energetic blocks I just can't find the way past. Although during the LSD trip .I could feel it clearing a lot. I have this 1 maybe 2 that I couldnt get through. And kept thinkin ayahuasca. What's a safe amount of time to wait in between the 2? 3-6 months? Then another flood in a year? If I still feel I need it that is. I was also wondering about microdosing, how long would I need to stop before ayahuasca? And I know I probably won't get any positive feedback from this, but still need to say something about it. I've taken kratom 3 times since my flood, justifying it by saying its natural, that I've been on just kratom in the past and detoxed without any discomfort, and well I've felt like I'm basically 2 weeks into detox since my flood. So haven't felt too great, or too bad though. Am I being a dumbass with the kratom?

Thank you.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2014, 09:25:54 AM by Paradoxical »

Offline mudhen

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #11 on: December 15, 2014, 08:11:16 PM »


message deleted, said too much.
« Last Edit: December 15, 2014, 08:31:24 PM by mudhen »

Offline lalababa

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Re: Finally flooded, more questions then answers
« Reply #12 on: December 16, 2014, 04:54:19 AM »
yes, kratom is just a slippery slope back to opiates.  You seem to still want to be in altered states and really now is the time to make new patterns and habits that don't involve substances.  Iboga gives you a chance to make these new habits...you know what a very good, natural high is that could also be beneficial in other ways?  Exercise!  Get busy with  that and you will feel better and make new habits.. just stop with all the others.. dont even think about aya or the good drugs for now.. focus on healing yourself.

lalababa