Author Topic: Phase one "Discovery Mode"  (Read 3179 times)

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Offline 93bywayofthedear

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Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« on: February 17, 2011, 02:43:26 AM »
So I am currently in "discovery mode", in regards to Iboga. When I am done with that, I will be in "preparation mode" and finally, "execution mode"

Actually, I should explains my intentions for why my interest in Iboga in the first place. After my ayahuasca experiences, I experienced much positive results. Physically speaking, I saw myself as a three dimensional holographic image. Pure energy. I experienced, first hand, some of my circuts being crossed and some sluggish and negative energy. She did not fix that but she changed my perspective about it and removed my judgment so that I could realize that all this was changeable and not to worry.

Since not drinking for a couple months now, I am seeing so clearly how some of my objects of addiction do not serve me. The top three are: sex, food, nicotine. My personal opinion about addiction is one of a spiritual nature. It is a bit simplistic but it works for me. I call it "the god muscle" I think every human being is born with the desire to be one with god, nature, the universe in his dna. It appears to be stronger in some and not so much in others. I like to believe that we were gifted this power as a means to search for, connect with the god of our understanding. Problem is, in these complicated times, humans get distracted and direct their consciousness toward something less like money, success, drugs etc. Anything to feel whole or loved. Once we have attached to a particular behavior, changing gets complicated. It is like the drug addict in 12 step who after realizing the negative results of the god he has chosen must throw up his hands and say "I was wrong, I do not want this as my god anymore, I want something better, bigger, more wholesome and positive as my god. And then the long process of creating behaviors and habits to re affirm his new allegiance begins. I do not see this phenomenon as the enemy. I see it as a part of my subconsciousness that does not have the thought process to comprehend outcomes. It only knows "drive!, get it!, eat it, smoke it!, fuck it!. I have seen addicts do some pretty magical and extraordinary things for a fix. This thing is powerful and I prefer to look at it as a possible ally. That same powerful ally could be saying 'help them!, be of service!, love her. I know it is not easy but it might be more simple than I might have thought before.

So anyway, my reason for working with Iboga. I know these behaviors are changeable. Could I do it cold turkey? probably. I have quit more addictive and destructive stuff before. This time around, I want to fully experience the process of letting go and making a new choice. I want a cut away version. I want to experience it on all levels. I cannot describe the feeling of compassion for myself as I talk about this. I mean, there is no part of me that needs to get beat up over this. I just want to know myself and I know the real me has better things to do than waste time on nicotine, sex, food in unhealthy ways and I intend to prove it to myself.

Ok, so how about micro dosing. Root seems cheap. I am used to mayan ethnobotanicals.  Would their root bark be ok for micro doses? How much. Could I work the next day?

Also, when I flood, I want the full pull. So how much of what from where?

Thank you sooo much!

« Last Edit: February 17, 2011, 02:47:23 AM by 93bywayofthedear »

Offline crazylife

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2011, 08:56:32 AM »
Hi there 93,

Ive spent ages reading and googling about Iboga. Ive just bought some HCL, and am waiting for the right time to take it. Ive found that being drawn to this substance has been part of the whole process, like the healing starts before you even take it. Like the mind knows how powerful it is, and is already making changes.
I just wanted to post to tell you not to bother with whole root before you waste you money. Its garbage.   8)

Root bark, HCL, and T.A are the 3 choices you have. T.A. is basically all the alkaloids out of the root bark. HCL is just the alkaloid Ibogaine out of the bark.
HCL is the one i have purchased.
Welcome to the forum, CL.

Offline roy d

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2011, 09:06:04 PM »

Hi93,

Crazylife told you right about what type to buy, they will all do about the same thing.  Ibogaine breaks habits, heroin, nicotine, coke, alcohol, sugar and junk foods.  I am not sure about sex addicts.  When your eating habits have change that means the treatment took.

Best,

 Roy

Offline 93bywayofthedear

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2011, 01:32:08 AM »
Ok, Thanks. Good to know.

CL. I certainly agree with you about the kind of courting or initiation that precedes the actual act. I experienced that with Ayahuasca too.
I assume that when you say that root bark is garbage, you are probably referring to it's capability compared to HCI for the goal that I described. I have read of many experiences on root bark alone that sound quite profound and alluring. Call me old fashioned, but something about being introduced to the more traditional "un-altered" plant seems attractive to me. Maybe I am actually looking more for a relationship. I am still just sussing it all out. Is there a possibility of starting off with a good amount of root bark and then having some HCI on hand to introduce a few hours into the experience?

Roy, It sounds like you are saying, Take the HCI and then you might not have the problem anymore. In your experience with HCI, were you conscious of the changes happening during your trip? Were you able to see for yourself where the wires were crossed? Were there profound insights? Was there conscious work involved or did you just realize that your behavior changed after the experience? 

Offline crazylife

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2011, 02:33:16 AM »
Hey 93,

Sorry i got confused. Thought you meant whole root, rather than root bark. Root bark is good. Apparently the most experienced treatment provider uses root bark, so that says alot for it. Who could argue with her.
Whole root is the stuff that is garbage. Theres very little alkaloid content in it, and you will basically spend a long time feeling ill and being sick.

Im still on the preperation bit. I made my desicion to buy HCL because my judgement is that it would be safer. Lower dosage, like 1-1.3 grammes of alkaloid and no other 'stuff' for the liver to process, compared to 4-5G of T.A. powder, or 20-30 grammes of root bark. But then im missing out on the whole variety of alkaloids found in the T.A. powder or bark. Some people say that even when you have T.A. you miss something that the bark offers, like its lost during the extraction process.
Took me a long time to decide what i was going to go for.
Some folk even say that the root bark must be took in the traditional method, chewed throughly and then swallowed, whilst others will say "sod that, just gel-cap it!"

I was lucky enough to win some root bark off this website, so i will be trying that at some point aswell. Ive already decided to stick it in 000 gel-caps rather than eating it though.
I dont know much about combining HCL, TA, and root bark. I know ive read threads and people do do it. I dont think its dangerous, as long as you work out the combined strength of everything you plan on taking, and you stagger your dosage safely. You would want someone whos experienced to confirm that for you, (whos done it themselves), im just going off trip reports ive read.
Theres plenty of experienced people on here man, CL.

Edited - Spelling mistakes.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2011, 03:08:01 AM by crazylife »

Offline GratefulDad

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2011, 05:56:59 PM »
I've only taken TA for flooding and bark for low dosages.  I can't comment on the HCl.  From what I understand from talking to people who have experienced flood doses with the various choices, it seems the HCl is the most abrupt, hits fast and hard and is over the quickest.  TA seems to come on slower, last longer, but be a bit more gentle, yet more full experience.  Bark seems to be very rich and full, much longer, with more effects, but feels much harder on the system and involves heavy purging.  Your mileage may vary. 

I have been happy with my TA floods, but may give the HCl a shot some time.  I was debating on flooding with the bark, but from talking to Bancopuma and Calaquendi, I may not really want to put myself through the ordeal of eating the bark.  With the doses I need of the alkaloids, I am afraid it would take me a large amount of bark, and I am not sure I can get it all in and down.  I really hate trying to get a full experience and falling short.
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Offline roy d

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #6 on: February 19, 2011, 01:11:44 PM »

Hi 93,

When CL said root bark is trash I believe he meant whole root, whole root is whole root and worthless.  Root bark is, I imagine, outside part of the root.  I am not exactly sure but good RB is good for after flooding to help fight the paws.

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Roy, It sounds like you are saying, Take the HCI and then you might not have the problem anymore. In your experience with HCI, were you conscious of the changes happening during your trip? Were you able to see for yourself where the wires were crossed? Were there profound insights? Was there conscious work involved or did you just realize that your behavior changed after the experience? 

Man, that is so hard to describe.  The last time I took 1.5 gm not all that much about 17mg/kg but it was so strong, I must be sensitive to it.  I took it and puked at the 1 hour mark then had an open eye visual then my head went down and I was out for a while.  Then I got some visions, very bizarre, could not understand it.  I was laying in bed and watching myself on the computer, now how can you be in bed watching yourself on the computer?

When I came out of it my behavior changed quite a bit.  I quit eating oatmeal and cut down of junk food, cola, coffee and sugar by 90% or more.  That was about 10 months ago and I sometimes have a coffee (coffee was never a problem) now and then and I am still down to maybe 1 glass of cola a day, usually less (I used to drink .5 to a liter per day).  As far as using opiates I am not 100% clean.  It seems like I use once a month or two which I can live with.  I do not recommend anyone else doing that for chipping is how we all relapse.  But since I cut my use 98% I consider it a success.  I do get cravings and try to not act on them but that has been a problem of mine for years - the cravings.

I did not have any profound insights, I was confused and not  able to hold a thought.  It took two weeks for me to return to normal.  Part of the problems may be because I was losing weight at the time and was not eating very good, like the day of the detox I had one chicken leg all day.  I believe this made for a harder detox.

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Call me old fashioned, but something about being introduced to the more traditional "un-altered" plant seems attractive to me.

I understand your line of thinking but do not agree with it.  When you eat a banana you do not eat the peal or on oranges either.  Apples are good and keep the doctor away but did you know the seeds contain cyanide?  Most house plants are poisonous.  The root bark has other alkaloids in it that makes it very hard on your system.  The toughest people have a Very hard time holding down 20gm of bark - experienced people.  Most would not do it again.

I hope I answered you questions if not ask again.  I am not too sure what you mean by
 
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Roy, It sounds like you are saying, Take the HCI and then you might not have the problem anymore.


but if I have not answered please let me know.

Best to all,

 Roy

Offline crazylife

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #7 on: February 20, 2011, 05:42:28 AM »
Hey Rod D,   8)

I was just wondering, whats wrong with OatMeal? I thought it was considered a very healthy food, as far as cereal goes?
Its the only cereal i eat, plain with water.   :P

Yeah, i was meaning whole root, im suprised the vendors even get away with selling it. Quite a few legal high shops in england here sell it, and are selling it as root bark aswell - its obvious from the price (15G for £15) it whole root. Scam artists.

CL.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2011, 07:40:48 AM by crazylife »

Offline roy d

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #8 on: February 20, 2011, 12:57:37 PM »

Hi CL,

There is nothing wrong with oatmeal for I ate it almost every day - guess you could say it was kind of a habit.  But after my detox I did not want that or sugar or soda or junk food.  I also did not like any kind of smoke or the smell of detergent at the supermarket.

Best,

 Roy

Offline Calaquendi

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #9 on: February 20, 2011, 01:03:30 PM »
Welcome to the forum, best of luck to you...just take your time - research -  and proceed with caution. We never want to see anyone harm themselves here - and thought iboga is safe in general, there are many considerations. My vote is usually 15-20 mg/kg and that should get you right where you want to be. Blessings!
" I am you and what I see is me..."

Offline 93bywayofthedear

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #10 on: February 21, 2011, 12:47:12 AM »
Thanks everyone for the food for thought.

Personally, I feel there is no better meal than steel cut oats with butter, brown sugar and heavy creme added to the boil for the last three minutes.

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I understand your line of thinking but do not agree with it.  When you eat a banana you do not eat the peal or on oranges either.  Apples are good and keep the doctor away but did you know the seeds contain cyanide?  Most house plants are poisonous.  The root bark has other alkaloids in it that makes it very hard on your system.  The toughest people have a Very hard time holding down 20gm of bark - experienced people.  Most would not do it again.

Roy, thanks for thorough feedback. I fully respect your opinion and believe it to be a valid point especially for the examples you gave. But I am going to push on this idea of working with the root bark for a flood until I can prove to myself that I can get all the benefits of Iboga without ever trying it the way it has been done for millennia. I am prepared to be wrong here and am looking forward to any more helpful info to help me make my final decision. One of my ayahuasca experiences, the purge lasted the whole journey. I was on my side, dying. The pain became waves in all of the senses. During peak, she told me that this was my birth. I re experienced the fear and pain of that. All i had to do was surrender and vomit and the ordeal would be over, but I avoided it in fear and just lay on my side. To vomit meant to consent to being born and all the crap that goes with that. Only when the pain in my body was so strong did I overcome the fear and release. So the "negative" side affect of the ayahuasca facilitated the appropriate ordeal necessary for that healing. These might be apples and oranges. I don't know.

This is very encouraging in itself.
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But after my detox I did not want that or sugar or soda or junk food.  I also did not like any kind of smoke or the smell of detergent at the supermarket.
 

CL. cannot wait to hear about your experience with those. Have you taken minute dose yet?

GD.
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I really hate trying to get a full experience and falling short.
I have been studying the forum and it appears that you are "hard head" though no?
Yours is a good point though. How would it be if I went the hard way the first time and fell short when I could have gotten the full pull much easier with HCI? I could always make the first attempt with HCI or TA and go back later and flood with bark if I felt I was missing something. Hmmmmn.

Calaquendi, Do you mean 15-20 mg/kg of root bark or 15-20 mg/kg of alkaloid or something. Sorry, just want to be sure.

Offline GratefulDad

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Re: Phase one "Discovery Mode"
« Reply #11 on: February 21, 2011, 12:57:00 AM »
GD.
Quote
I really hate trying to get a full experience and falling short.
I have been studying the forum and it appears that you are "hard head" though no?
Yours is a good point though. How would it be if I went the hard way the first time and fell short when I could have gotten the full pull much easier with HCI? I could always make the first attempt with HCI or TA and go back later and flood with bark if I felt I was missing something. Hmmmmn.

Calaquendi, Do you mean 15-20 mg/kg of root bark or 15-20 mg/kg of alkaloid or something. Sorry, just want to be sure.


Yes, I am a hard head and super insensitive to everything, so please take that into consideration.  I was born to do psychedelics, perhaps, as huge dose of many, over long periods have proven fine for me, but not for everyone.  But shaking yourself up enough helps facilitate the biggest change.  My first dose by far was the biggest and the most effective/best I have done.  As for the bark, TA, HCl debate, you can keep eating bark until you get to where you need to go, but it can be more difficult. 

There is a way to help the stomach contents to drop into the large intestine, I read about over on the DMT-Nexus.  Apparently you massage the area just below your ear, behind the jaw bone.  This will make the stomach contents empty into the large intestine, and prevent you from vomiting it up.  I tried it and it felt as if it worked, I could feel it in my stomach.  One should probably be careful doing that too much, though, because the purge can be useful in determining when you have had enough. 

Cal means 15-20 mgs per kg of body weight, of the HCl or when the extract is all very pure alkaloids.  If it is 70% active TA, then each gram would be like 700 mgs, instead of a whole gram, and this should be taken into account when dosing.  PTA can probably be dosed just like the HCl.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2011, 12:59:26 AM by GratefulDad »
GratefulDad

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